The Leader Fast Lane - Episode 17 - with Amanda McAfee, CEO & President of the Lubbock Area United Way

In this episode, I had a delightful conversation with Amanda McAfee, President and CEO of the Lubbock Area United Way. Amanda is an amazing leader that builds value-driven teams, leads effective community collaboration, and raises up new leaders. Listen in as she talks about:

2:22 - Saying "yes" to opportunities as a young leader & learner

8:37 - Letting the journey take you where it takes you

15:00 - Why it is important to surround yourself with wise people

19:24 - Leading with an abundance - as opposed to scarcity - mindset

24:29 - Building team culture and enjoying the fruits of a healthy team

32:14 - How to build a coalition of diverse constituents

41:11 - Avoiding burnout: take off the superhero cape

49:22 - It's ok to fail, as failure is learning

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:09

Hello and welcome to the Leader Fast Lane, the podcast where I talk with accomplished leaders from higher education, public service, and beyond to hear real stories, practical principles, and hard-earned lessons listeners can apply immediately. No buzzwords, no shortcuts, just real leaders sharing real lessons you can apply right away. I'm Lane Mears, Assistant Vice Chancellor for Leader and Culture Development at the Texas Tech University System. Today I am joined by Amanda McAfee, president and CEO of Lubbock Area United Way. Amanda is a Lubbock native and a Coronado High School graduate. She has a Bachelor of Social Work from Abilene Christian University and a Master of Arts and Leadership from Denver Seminary. Her nonprofit experience spans more than two decades, including serving as a Peace Corps volunteer in South Africa, where she worked in the nonprofit development program. Amanda returned to Lubbock in 2012. Before joining United Way, she worked for the United Way Community Partners Catholic Charities and the Volunteer Center of Lubbock. Amanda joined the United Way team in 2017 as a campaign division director. She stepped into the Vice President of Communications and Marketing position in 2018 and the Vice President of Community Impact role in 2022. Amanda's daughter, Caroline, is a civil engineering major at Abilene Christian University, and her son Jack is in third grade at Hardwick Elementary School. The three enjoy camping, playing at the park, visiting the library, and participating in the many family activities Lubbock offers. It's great to have you on the podcast, Amanda.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

Well, I'm so happy to be here, Lane. Thanks for inviting me.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

It's my pleasure. I look forward to our conversation. As we begin, could you please tell us a little bit about your background and leadership journey?

SPEAKER_01 1:58

Well, first of all, I have to say my son's no longer in third grade. That happened in the last week. Um so yeah, we're we're off to a great start for the summer. Um yeah, I you know, thinking back on my leadership journey, I sometimes I look at it and go, this was haphazard. This was there was there was no plan in it necessarily. It's not like I intended to end up being in the position I'm currently in. You it I think it's a lot of taking opportunities and saying yes. There, you know, when for instance, you know, you read about Peace Corps being in my background. That was a thing where I was in my um mid-late 20s and I was doing a lot of work at that point in time. Um, the red campaign with Bono was a big deal. Um, and I was, you know, looking at that and going, man, I have all these facts and figures about the developing world in my head, but I don't have a personal relationship with anybody. And so I started looking at opportunities. And my mother, who was an Oklahoma and Texas native, had not left Lubbock. You know, I mean, I we grew up Lubbock. She kept saying, when am I coming back to Lubbock? But she at one point in time actually talked about a program that Tech was doing with Peace Corps because it was in the Lebbock Avalanche Journal. And she was like, Have you considered Peace Corps? And I was like, absolutely not. Also, my mother is telling me, but is this something going on in the background there? There's spiritual forces at work here that my mother is saying move across the world. Um, and that's that's what started my Peace Corps journey. Um I just said yes. So, yeah, so that was one of those serendipitous moments. Um, I also, after I graduated from college, I ended up in Portland, Oregon for a while. You couldn't get in a more opposite place from Lubbock, Texas, Portland, Oregon. I love both places. You know, I tell people don't try to figure out where I stand on things because I was a Church of Christ preacher's kid and a Peace Corps volunteer. So don't try to guess me and figure out where, you know, where I stand on things because you're gonna end up wrong on some fact or figure. But I a lot of saying yes to when opportunities come. But I will also say I think in the last decade of my career, really more since I became a mom, it was also learning to say no to and learning to that not every opportunity is the right opportunity. And so learning to say, what are the right yeses? Um, and I I think you get to you can figure that out a little bit more when you get in your 30s and 40s. When you're in your 20s, I mean, that's what I'm telling my daughter now. Say yes to everything. Like take every opportunity that comes your way. And then probably when you get in your 30s and 40s, there might be some things that you start wanting to say no to.

SPEAKER_00 4:47

That's that's wise advice. In fact, my thirdborn just turned 18 this past weekend, and my wife did an amazing job of of planning the day and and getting input from siblings and cousins and aunts and uncles words of advice for for for my son and my oldest son, who's 24. His advice was say yes to more things.

SPEAKER_01 5:13

You know, well, you've raised a wise kid, sounds like, and happy birthday to your youngest.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

Thank you. Um, where were you in South Africa, by the way?

SPEAKER_01 5:25

So I started when I was in Peace Corps, I was in a village called Mamothlaki. Um it's about an hour north of Pretoria, which is the capital city. Um, and then I so I did I was there for about a year and a half, and then I started working for a children's home that was actually um in Randburg, which is a suburb of Johannesburg.

SPEAKER_00 5:43

Okay.

unknown 5:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:44

Fascinating. Okay. I I had Achilles repair surgery in Pretoria.

SPEAKER_01 5:48

So that's well, then we were probably in similar hospitals because I did a few stents in that with parasites and other things.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

Exactly. Good. All right. Well, I've got uh a series of of themes for the questions I'm gonna ask. Um, and then we'll just go theme by theme and and and engage on these. Uh so the first one is is a little bit deeper into your personal leadership journey. When you look back on your leadership journey, what experiences most shaped the leader you are today?

SPEAKER_01 6:21

Wow. Wow. That's such a I love that question because it really asks you to frame and look back at some things. You know, I actually went through um some stuff with my executive coach the other day that was really a reframing for some things. You know, there's there's this research that shows that in fourth grade, that's when you really shape a lot of the things that happen in fourth grade are really going to shape who you are gonna end up being a little later in life, and some shadow sides and things that you carry with you, but also some really great stuff. So that was my dad was an accountant until I was 10 years old in the fourth grade, and then he became a preacher. Um, so that was a huge shift for our family. It meant changing churches from the church that I had grown up in, and it was just a huge shift. And so I all of a sudden I was thrown in with this, you know, whole new group of kids that I didn't know that I hadn't gone to church with all my life. And that was, you know, what a lot of time, I think for most of my life, when I looked back at that experience, I thought that was really hard. Um, and it was. There were a lot of hard things about that, that a lot of changing and and trying to figure out and world. It was a big change, obviously, for my whole family, not just me. Um, but I also looked back, and that meant that I actually started getting thrown into some leadership experiences when I was really young. Um, I had I had a hard time making friends at the new church. It was really clickish. Um, ended up making friends, but initially it felt really clickish. But of course, I think all 10-year-old girl things feel clickish. That's just part of it. But um, so I started going in with my parents to some of the younger kids' classes and helping teach younger kids' classes. And I really think like it was this was just an epiphany from a couple of weeks ago that that really started shaping my experience. I started getting leadership experiences at a young age and really kind of I think sent me on a trajectory that I don't know if I hadn't had that harder experience, I wouldn't have had those positive experiences that went alongside it. So that's just an epiphany from the last couple of weeks as I've been working on stuff with my executive coach that really sent me on that journey. Um, but I I think there's also beyond that, too, a lot of times, you know, and I I I have we have college age kids now, both of us have college-age kids. And so there's this like, I've got to go in and I've got to decide a major, and that's gonna be my life. And there's the just this weight that is put on that time of life. Well, I was a social work major, um, never, you know, didn't really see the trajectory of my life happening at all. That I, you know, it is. I mean, I stayed in the nonprofit world, but the the way that I stayed in the nonprofit world is not your typical social work journey. And so I think that was the other thing is just being allowing yourself to again let the journey take you where it takes you, you know, and not um say, well, this isn't the plan, you know, and kind of I guess letting go of some control around it and realizing that life is gonna happen around you and again accepting those opportunities that come up. I think those are the things when again, back to that kind of idea that I was talking about at first. When you say yes, you just don't know what doors are gonna open for you and where you're gonna end up. Um and for me, it's led to some really cool places that I've ended up in.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

I love that. That's fantastic. And and my journey is a little bit like yours that I was a sociology major in college. It was the path of least resistance to to graduation. Um, and yeah, didn't have anything really planned out, and so twists and turns, and I'm thankful for where I am. Whereas my wife knew from 10 years old she wanted to be an engineer, third to fourth generation. And so her path she had a vision for. And we both ended up in good places professionally. And so I think it's it is it is freeing for for for I think some younger folks not to feel like they have to have it all figured out right now because you know we're still growing and learning what what's really gonna motivate us and and and be our passion, and like you've said, try new things and find that passion and invest yourself in it.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Well, and I think I I think it's you know, I love that your wife is an engineer. My, you know, I think we said my daughter is studying engineering, and I I I look back at that time too, and I love the opportunities that are available, especially for girls, but really for everybody. Because if you wanted to do good in the world, you probably at our time in life chose our path for sociology, social work, nursing, maybe teaching. Like those were the do good professions that we had available to us. Now my daughter is wanting to do civil engineering because she wants to help build infrastructure in places because she understands how important infrastructure is to the world.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:08

I I never would have even thought of that. I never would have thought of social entrepreneurism and all of these other things that are available to us that we can do good in the world now. So I just I love how we've advanced culturally to see other professions beyond just you know those those ones that we were the were the profession helping professions when we went into college.

SPEAKER_00 11:29

Yeah, yeah, that's great. I love that that that's your daughter's vision. That's cool. And having awesome. Having worked in a lot of places where infrastructure really is suffering, I I I 100% believe that that she can have a huge impact doing that. Yeah, me too. Who are some of the leaders or mentors who influenced you early on and what did they model well?

SPEAKER_01 11:52

Yeah, so I I think I've been really blessed um to have a lot of mentors. I don't know that at the time I would have, you know, said this is a mentor, but now looking back, I I do see those people as mentors. Uh, you know, it starts for me in college. That's the first person that really just jumps into my head was my advisor, Bill Culp. And Bill saw, well, he saw that I was more of a macro type of a person than a micro type of a person. So he instead of when I was doing my internships for social work, instead of placing me in your typical social work one-on-one client type of setting, he actually had me placed at the nonprofit management center. And so I was helping organizations get their nonprofit status. I was, you know, doing training for um organizations on how to do client navigation and how to do client management. Um, I was helping write grants. I was doing things that probably none of my peers were doing, that was for sure. Um, because I was having this opportunity. And he just I he saw that I was a systems thinker and saw how I he could he could really see how systems work together. And that really, again, that was just one of those things that I, you know, was able to say yes to when he when he brought it to me and that set me on a trajectory. But there was also just things in the ways that he led, um, leading with a lot of, you know, when you're thinking about you're again shaping these young, early 20s, you know, late teens, early 20s kids. And he was, I mean, I imagine in in my head, he was probably in his late 50s. I don't know what how old he actually was at that time, but that's kind of where I picture him at. To have such um empathy and understanding for where students were and to really be able to take these brains that were not fully formed yet and say, this is what I see in your life and what I see as good. It was just something that I still try to emulate. You know, he wasn't necessarily the first person in the room to talk, but every time, you know, every time he did talk, you wanted to stop and pause and listen to what he said because it was just, you know, he's just one of those guys that you just wanted to sit and sit at his feet and soak it in. Um, you know, from there, I was when I ended up in Portland, you know, another, so I was working for a nonprofit slash church type type situation, and another one of um the leaders really took me under his wing. Um, I mean, I golly, I was so dumb, like looking back, like I can just see, like I was so dumb and inexperienced. And he just walked beside me in so many ways and allowed me to be dumb, but then also would like push back on me and be like, really, is that the way that it is? Um, you know, and so that was just that that is a great experience. And you know, now I just I feel like I can just name people like it, it's again one of those things that I try to instill in my kids now is surround yourself with wise people, especially wise adults, white people who are older than you that have gone a little bit farther in the journey and just kind of surround yourself with those people. Um, I think that's harder these days than it used to be because we have less access to be in spaces with people than we than we used to. But really, that was one of the things is I just I always had somebody who was a little bit farther along in their journey that I was walking behind and that they were allowing me to walk behind them and teaching me as I went. And that's just been such a blessing over my life.

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Yeah. And I love to hear that you've taken what those folks modeled for you and are trying to do it for others.

SPEAKER_01 15:48

I hope so. I hope so.

SPEAKER_00 15:51

That's good. Our next theme is leadership philosophy and decision making. What does effective leadership look like in a nonprofit environment where resources are limited, but the needs are significant?

SPEAKER_01 16:07

Yeah. What yeah. Another, another really good thoughtful question. Um, Lane, why why would I expect anything less from you and the good and thoughtful questions? You know, I think leadership in a nonprofit looks a lot like leadership and for-profits. I actually a lot of times think we do ourselves a disservice when we think of the two separately, because at the end of the day, it's a business and it needs to be run well. And we're always working with scarce resources, no matter whether we're in the for-profit or nonprofit um world. There's always some level of scarce resources that we're dealing with. So we can get though in the nonprofit world, we can get so stuck in that scarcity mindset, though, that it can really inhibit us from operating to our full potential. So we really, you know, try when we look at United Way, when I when I look at other organizations that I get to work with, try not to think in a zero-sum thinking. Try to really look and go, you know, there is a different perspective that we can take with. Maybe that resource is scarce, but what other resources do we have that are plentiful that could make up for that? Or how do we go about getting more of that resource? I think when we operate in a scarcity mindset, it makes us very closed in how we do things and we're afraid of not getting our piece of a pie. I see it especially that probably happens more in the funding piece of it than anything, is that oh, there's only so many grant dollars, or there's only so many donations that you know we can get. And if we don't get our piece, then that means that you know we're not gonna, that's gonna hinder our budget for the next year or whatever, whatever it is, or we're not gonna be able to hire that person or buy that new computer or whatever that thing is. But what I have often found is that when we actually open that up and we're more collaborative, especially when it comes to funding and the way that we do that, often more comes in. I think that's why United Ways are so successful, is because they have a collaborative funding model. They're not just raising money for the organization itself, they're helping fund and support all of these other organizations and they're working with that. I think that's why people want to donate to that, because they trust that. But I mean, we see it in the grant world too. When we say, hey, or A, B, and C, do y'all want to go in on this grant with us? Then more likely than not, those funders is gonna say, ooh, look at this cool collaborative opportunity, and we're really making, you know, the bank for a buck there. Um, so yeah, that that's one of the biggest things I think I see is that um oftentimes we just get into this scarcity mindset that can really be inhibiting for a nonprofit um and trying to open that up and and open, you know, have a have a little broader worldview instead of just in that scarcity place.

SPEAKER_00 19:03

That's great. I love that. And and it resonates having worked in a nonprofit for five years. Uh the that that's the temptation is to have that scarcity mindset. Um but I admire that y'all are have more of the abundance that that there's more out there and we'll do more, we'll get more by being collaborative. Um when I worked for this nonprofit, um was in in Rwanda for four years, and our casework was on actually it was Kenya when I just came out, but we were doing a child sexual assault case work. Difficult stuff. Hard, yeah, a lot of need. Small nonprofit, small resources. So we had to be very disciplined and careful how we couldn't take every case. Right. And so we had we had to be very careful about how we invested the resources. And I'm a question for you you know, different scenario but similar is concept is how do you maintain clarity and focus when there are so many competing community needs?

SPEAKER_01 20:07

Yeah, I think that's um that's a really good question for a united way, too. Um, so the the point of a united way is to be the convener in the community, that we're really looking at what are the specific needs that are happening in our community and how do we bring people around that need so that we're um really attacking the roots of the problem, not just uh you know it attacking you know the leaves and the branches, but we're actually getting to that root so that we're um improving the community as a whole in that process. So that means so this is our 80th year um in Ludwig. Um, and in that 80 years, that means what we have been focused on and what we have been doing has changed a lot over that time. Um, you know, there's some needs that are true. Like you'll you'll always have um people that are struggling to get by and need some of those that social service aspects, need some of that safety net aspect. But you'll also have from time to time, like um, you know, a big focus for us in the 90s was low birth weight babies. Well, that's not such a problem in our area anymore. Um, I think thanks to United Way and others that were involved in that. And so that's not a big focus for us anymore. So we look, we we do work a lot with data and looking at what is the data telling us about what is happening in our community. Um and therefore, where can we use the might of the United Way brand, um, the power of our huge volunteer base, the power of our connections to really go after a problem, to really take whatever those gaps or those opportunities are and find ways to address them. With that, then it's really um. For one, I think data makes it clear so that we don't have mission creep. Um, you know, if you uh if people aren't familiar with that term, it's where you have this is what the stated mission of the organization is, but then you start doing this program over here, probably because there was some source of funding. That's usually what causes mission creep is there was a great funding opportunity over here. And so we ended up doing this thing over here, but it wasn't really quite our mission or it was mission adjacent. But when we're really looking at the data, um, that allows us to be really mission focused. Now, I'll also say in some ways, I think our job is a little bit easier because Rubby Gare United Way's mission is simply giving people hope. So as things change, that allows us to be really nimble and pivot easily. So, you know, while healthcare, healthcare is a focus for us, but during the pandemic, it became much more of a focus for us. And really, it was even more just getting resources and access for people as we were all, you know, dealing with all of the things that went around with the pandemic. So we were able to pivot really quickly and easily, but still being within the scope of our mission. Um, but you know, it's one of those things that I laugh at. I love, love, love, love dogs. I love my my, I have a gigantic burnoodle who is just, he's like 90 pounds of just pure muscle, and he just drags me everywhere and pounces and he's wonderful. We don't serve dogs at United Way. Like we're we don't have any any agencies that are animal services. That being said, some of our places that we fund might have some programs that are connected with animals because animals provide such great therapy. Or, you know, so there are places where we connect, but we're never gonna partner with and really in a strategic way with an animal service organization because our mission is giving people hope.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

Right, right. Fascinating. Great answer. Um, I appreciate that. And I'm having trouble picturing what a what a burn a doodle looks like.

SPEAKER_01 24:00

I'll have to yeah. Black, he's black, he's got a lovely white collar. He was the cutest of the litter when we picked him out, and he was very quiet and docile, like he wasn't running around like all the other puppies were. Turned out that would he was fooling us because he's just full of him and vigor.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

Wow, 90 pounds. All right, we're gonna shift cult uh um uh topics to team culture and people leadership.

SPEAKER_01 24:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 24:29

What have you learned about building healthy organizational culture?

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Oh gosh. Okay, so Lane, this is the place, and uh I think the rest of your team knows it. This is the place where I can really get nerdy. I love team culture, I think it is so important to a healthy organization. Um, and and I think it's especially a lot when you work in the nonprofit space, there is, I don't know if burnout is more prevalent or we just hear about it more. Um, and maybe that goes back to that scarcity mindset, but it burnout burnout is definitely a thing. And so I think if you don't have a healthy culture within that, that that just amplifies that aspect. I think with a healthy culture, you can still have burnout. Um, that can still happen for a person, depending on what's going on, even with a healthy culture. But I think with a hell with if you do have a healthy culture, you're you're setting yourself up to hopefully prevent burnout. Um so we do a lot um at our organization. In fact, our whole team, we just spent at the last several um staff meetings, which we call rumbles after Brene Brown. We don't call them staff meetings. Um, I do a we do a lot of Brene Brown stuff around here and others, but um, but we call our staff meetings rumbles. So after our last several rumbles, um we actually went over back over our core values. We've got a lot of new staff, and so we spent our last several times spending some time on each of our core values and really digging into you know, what does integrity mean? And what does it mean for our organization? What does it mean in your specific role? What does it mean for us to be one team united? What does it mean for us to have visionary link leadership? What does that mean for us to be community-minded? And we really spent time on each of those four of those, um, really digging in and looking at looking at that from the different perspectives, um, which was really, you know, especially when we have we've had so many, we we've had a lot of um longtime employees retire over the last two years. And so we've got a lot of people that are coming in new to our organization. And so it was really good to hone in and say, this is who we are as an organization, that you personally probably have your personal values and we want you to know what those are. But then how do you take your personal values and lean into the core values of the organization? So that that was for me, I again nerdy. I got like nerded out every time, and I'm sure my team was like, oh my gosh, there she goes again, talking about team culture and core values. But at the end of the day, like we have people who um it it because of the culture we have created, feel appreciated, they feel valued. Um, you know, we had we I had a really great moment with one of our team. We were um doing an exercise where we were again, we were talking about visionary leadership. And so I had them do an exercise where everybody had a sticky note, and I had them put down on the sticky note. What is one idea that you have thought of that would be that you think would be just you know a game changer for the organization, a bold idea, but you've been too scared to say what it is. And write that out on a sticky note and put it up on the wall, it's anonymous. Um, but we had just one, this one, you know, so we're reading through them and we're kind of talking about the different ideas, but we had this one idea that was just, I mean, it just you know rose to the top. It was the just the cream, but just just beautiful idea. And I I like I read it and we all looked around at each other and I could see everybody's eyes going, this is a fabulous idea. Like, we don't even really need to discuss it, we just need to do it. And I was like, who is this? Like, who's who was this? Well, it turned out it was our database administrator um who has had some kind of hard jobs over his career. And I just took that sticky note and I walked it over to um my team that's in charge of that area because it wasn't even in his area, like it was an idea for a different team. And I walked it over to that team, I handed them the sticky note and I said, do this. Like, let's make this happen. And I got a note later from him of like, nothing like that has ever happened in my entire life. That's and thank you. And it wasn't me, it was our team and our culture empowering him to be able to use his voice. And I I just like that is probably, you know, looking back, so I've been in this CEO role for three years. I'm I'm gonna be honest, that's one of my proudest moments to go like we've really cracked culture around here. Like I we had when I so I've been here for um at United Way for nine years now. I would never say we had a bad culture, but we had some we had some things that needed to be fixed um and to be worked on. And I really feel like that moment was a moment that I went, we have created the kind of culture that our organizational values speak to. And that just made me so proud of our team and our organization.

SPEAKER_00 29:41

That's that is fantastic. Man, that's powerful.

SPEAKER_01 29:46

Yeah, it was it was a great moment. It was a really great moment.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

I love it. And I think when we first met last year, I I told you what drew me to this this role was being a part of a team that helped organizations not only identify those core values, but operationalize them to live them out. And when when and to hear stories like that of how it's happening in the impact really is amazing. Love it.

SPEAKER_01 30:15

Well, it I think that's why we've had so much fun. I've had so much great crossover with your team because um I really I believe in values-driven organization, and and I knew that you guys did too. And um, I think that's it's just what makes a great, you're a great organization and a great team. And when you can fall back on those core values and know as long as we are exercising and operating within those core values, we're gonna be okay. Not that things aren't gonna be hard at times. I I think there's can be this myth around that of like, that means you know, our company profit is gonna skyrocket or we're just gonna do great. We're actually in in a hard season right now. I told you about all those people who retired. Some of them had several of them had been here for like 20 plus years. And so when you go through that kind of change in an organization, that can be really hard. Plus, funding landscapes have changed for nonprofits. And so, you know, funding has been hard in the last couple of years. You know, there's just everything that's kind of happening in the environment around us just makes for a hard environment for an organization that is about convening and pulling people together, kind of hard because people are having a hard time coming together right now. So it's it's not that things aren't hard, but when we're operating in our core values, it means that we're headed the right direction and we can deal with the hard days because we know like we are going the right way. Um, and I think that's just it, that is something like if I had any advice to give to like somebody who is coming into a new organization or starting a new organization, or you know, both both on the for-profit or nonprofit side of like figure out what your core values are early on and operate out of that. And it's just gonna make it you're gonna know what direction to head if you have that in place.

SPEAKER_00 32:09

Right. Provides definitely clarity for for uh a group. We're gonna shift to community leadership and impact. And so you you've talked a little bit about this about the um you know collaboration and and building networks and and so the the work that you're doing, community leadership, requires bringing people together with different priorities and perspectives. So, how do you approach that coalition building?

SPEAKER_01 32:36

Oh, yeah, that isn't that the fun topic. Well, um, let me go back and say Church of Christ ministers, kid, but Peace Corps volunteer. So don't try to figure me out and where I stand on any of these because um you're you're just not going to. But I I think and I think that actually is the biggest piece. Um, so we have um my absolute favorite thing. So the other thing that I get really nerdy about and giddy about, and I'm sure all of these people that are involved in this think that I'm actually a lunatic because I get so giddy when these people get around a table together. But we have what we call the LBK Community Collaborative. Essentially, it is leaders from all over our city, all over our county, really. Um, actually, I'd even expand that to region because we've got South Plains and some others involved that are outside of Lubbock County, um, that they come around a table quarterly. We've spent, we spent all of last year saying, okay, what are some of the key issues in our community that we think when we have this group of people around a table that we can really figure out how to create some solutions around. And so we've spent the we spent all last year working on that. And this year we're deploying work groups that are meeting more often than that quarterly basis to really be able to focus on. So we've got a group that's looking at transportation, at public transportation. We've got another group that is looking at upskilling and reskilling the workforce. We've got a group that's looking at child care and getting kids get kindergarten ready. We've got a group that's focused just on data and making sure that we are gathering and sharing data. But in that room, you have the mayor and the county judge and the tech president's office and the LCU president, you have South Plains College, you like you have the decision makers that are coming together in the room. Which, number one, getting all of those people in the room together and we're not like all sitting at a luncheon together, like, but we're actually there to do work, is just it's silly fun. Like we, I think we actually all get kind of giddy around it because we don't get to do that kind of stuff very often. Um, so it's a lot of fun. But it's also so when we have a work, our work group that's working on public transportation, for instance, and they have a roadblock, we can bring that roadblock up to the other group and say, okay, in this this group where all the decisions makers are here, what can we do about this? Now, as you can imagine, when I start listing off some of those people that are involved in this, there's a lot of different perspectives in the room. A lot of different people who are, whether they're coming from a different political or policy standpoint, ideological standpoint, there's just a lot of perspectives in the room. And figuring out how to um build that kind of collective impact model um has been at times, I'm not gonna lie, tricky. Um, but I think the biggest thing is coming at it from gosh, I almost want to call it a Lubbock perspective. Um, Lane, I know you haven't been here long, but there is something very unique about this community. Um, and I hope you're seeing it. I've lived in a lot of different places, but every research institution that I know that comes in and does some sort of like research project, whether it's the Meadows Foundation or somebody else, they say, y'all are actually really good at collaborating. And I think it's the neighborliness of Lubbock that makes it where you know you can have two people that probably ideologically oppose sitting next to each other at this table, but they see the need and they're gonna figure out, okay, how can we work together on the need? Um, so the Lubbockness of it does make that piece of it easier, but I think it's also recognizing um there is not just one answer. A lot of times when we go where a lot of times actually, where I see coalitions breaking down is because you have people who think they're right. Um you might be right right now, or you might be right in the future, or maybe you were right in the past, but there's a lot of different ways that we can approach the problem. Um, for instance, um, so we have a data asset called Alice. It stands for asset limited income constrained employed. So it's really what is a living wage in a community? What does it take to actually get by when you're paying for child care, you're paying your rent, you're paying your utilities, and all those. And so what do you actually need to make in order to get by in that community? And so 49% of households in Lubbock County live below that. Um, just you know, so half, half of our households in this community live do not earn a living wage. Um, you know, and some of those that are in that higher, you know, closer to that line, they're probably getting by to buy by day by day. But then, you know, as we come into summer and air conditioners go out, how are we gonna pay for an air conditioner to get fixed? Because we don't have any savings. Um, and so now, you know, we're going into you know more credit card debt, or we're going to a payday lender, you know, we're we're having to make really hard decisions in order to get that taken care of. So the thing about that Alice data set is it's um you can approach it from a political lens, um, but that's not actually really helpful. Um, because the easy, the easy thing that you might want to do if you're on one side, and one side might want to say, well, we just need to pay everybody more. Well, yes, but now if I'm, you know, say UMC and I just start paying everybody more, which I'm not saying umc pays bad. I don't know what their pay scale is, but I'm just using them as an example. If I'm um c and I just start paying everybody more, who do I have to let go from my staff? Or what other costs have to go up in order for me to pay people more? Like it's not it's not an easy solution when it comes to that. And so we tend to go when we look at that data set, there's a systems fix, but there's also a lifting up of households fix and lifting up of the individual. And so I think that's where you really have to step back and look of going, there is not a set of policies on the right or the left that is going to fix this issue. You need both. Right. Um, and there's a lot of other things that we look at of like, you actually need both of those ideas to come together. And I think we get so deep, especially when we're talking about left and right, we get so deep into our um, whatever our pocket is, that we forget that there's not everything's gonna work on that side, and not everything's gonna work on this side. And we're gonna try some things, and we're gonna throw some spaghetti at the wall and see what happens, but you really have to have both in order to make it work.

SPEAKER_00 39:36

One follow-up question. Yeah. So in in a room like you've described, the mayor, the LCU president, tech president, um, you know, others, those those are all leaders. Who drives that discussion?

SPEAKER_01 39:51

Um maybe me. Um sometimes it's a little hard to be in the driver's seat, but I at least keep us on track of like, okay, here's our agenda and this is what we're gonna go through. Um it is I would say so. It the nice part about being a United Way is that um we are a neutral space. So when people come to our office, they're not expecting, you know, well, uh, although our school districts get along great at the admin level, I'm not gonna be, I'm gonna excuse you this example. It's not like we're Cooper pirates over here, or we're Coronado Mustangs over here, or we're Friendship Tigers or Friendship Panthers. Like United Way is for all of those schools. And we are for all of the higher education in our community. We're for the city, we're for the county, we're for people and citizenry. So it's it's I will say it's a little bit easier for us to convene and drive that conversation because we are seen as a neutral party, um, that as opposed to somebody who has their agenda out there. Now, I probably not everybody views us that way. I know that there are some places that think the United Way has this big agenda, but we don't. We we we try to be a neutral party that's pulling everybody together.

SPEAKER_00 41:09

That's great. All right, I'm gonna share a little bit. We're gonna talk about resilience, balance, and growth. And you talked a little bit about burnout earlier, and and and I have some theories on why that tends to be more prevalent in a non in nonprofit work. Um, I'll share my theory. Um is is that is that it's I think it's compassion fatigue. I think there's there's so much need out there that you're confronted with every day that from one perspective, your efforts can seem like a drop in the bucket. And so that can lead to, I think, uh maybe disillusionment, maybe some burnout. Um you know, that's something we faced when I was working for an international justice mission in in in East Africa, is maintaining that perspective on helping the individual, not being overwhelmed by the need, but doing what you can in front of you today to help the people in front of you today. Um but for you as the leader, how do you avoid burnout and stay grounded?

SPEAKER_01 42:14

Yeah, such um, again, another good question. And and I do, I think I agree with you. I think that when you add compassion fatigue in there, that really does heighten the um the happenstance, I guess, of of burnout. You know, I actually read uh there was an interesting article uh in Fast Company um just this last week. I'm not sure if they I think it was just an online article, but it was actually about how popular a burnout has become on TikTok and other things, people talking about burnout and everything. And I I am not on TikTok, so I don't know how popular it is, but the article said it was popular on TikTok. I believe it, um, because we're just therapizing the internet right now and using all of these words. And burnout actually is a clinical term. Like you actually have to, I mean, I guess you have to be diagnosed with burnout, but like it's a clinical term. And we use it as well, I'm in a a really intense season right now, but like burnout happens over many consecutive months and many consecutive years. I mean, I think Elaine, I'm hearing you that you've you've had some of that personal experience, and I I've had some personal experience with it. Sometimes I think right now we are like, oh man, works really hard right now. Well, how long has it been hard? Are you just in a season, or is it um, is it true burnout? Like, what are like let's let's dig a little bit deeper into that. Um, so that that's my just my first thought is that that article has been pinging in my head lately, um, especially as I'm um leading some of the generation Z, and they're on more online, and there's this therapeutic speak that is everywhere online right now. So that's been pinging in my head. But um I I think though, in avoiding burnout. And like you said, that compassion, fatigue, peace is also, you know, you look at what am I actually capable of doing? Like I in nonprofit, we tend to put our superhero capes on and think I can change the world. And that's true in the way that a drop of water causes a ripple that changes the surface of a lake. It is not true in that you fully can change the surface of a lake or how a lake will function forever. Like that drop is a ripple, and eventually that ripple ripples out. That's a terrible way to say that, but you get what I'm saying. But we have to take the superhero capes off. So recent thing that happened last um Texas legislative session, um, we were working on some policy stuff. We, you know, we tend to, we tend to work in both the DC and the Austin uh spaces on good, you know, advancing good public policy. And so we were working on some policy stuff. And all of a sudden, seemingly out of nowhere, Lubbock had the speaker of the house. And it was so exciting and so wonderful, and one of the best things that has happened for Lubbock on a statewide space in a long time. Like it was just wonderful. And all of a sudden, I was getting all of these phone calls from nonprofits and coalitions around the state who were asking if I could ask things of the speaker. And wonderful, we had the relationship with Speaker Burroughs that I could reach out to his team and I could talk to him and say, hey, this issue's coming up, or you know, this bill is out there, and we, you know, could we look at the language on this or what, you know, and we because we had the relationship. So people are speaking out, knowing, you know, reaching out to me, knowing that I have the relationship and that I can. But I got about halfway through and I was like, dang, I am so tired. Like I am just exhausted. This session is killing me. And when I started to unpack that with my executive coach and with my counselor, what I realized is like I had put my superhero tape on. Like it was up to me to make sure good legislation, good public policy legislation was crafted. Uh I'm just on that drop. I am a drop in causing a ripple. I can influence and I can use my influence, but I'm I'm not actually in the legislature myself. Like I there's only so much that I can do. And I really had to start. Um, and that there was another um one of our policy advocates that we work with through the United Ways of Texas. She was kind of like, you have to stop saying yes to everybody. Like, I I know you want to influence, but there is only so much that you can do, and you really like it's okay for you to tell them no. Um, and so uh we really honed in, worked, I worked with our public policy committee to say, what are the things that we really need to be focusing on? And let's focus on that. And if there's something that we feel like is in United Ways lane, and we can say, hey, we support this or we don't support this, we will do that. But we are not going to, we're not gonna burn ourselves out on it. We're also not going to abuse the relationship that we have with the speaker's office either. Yep. Um, and that was that was a mind shift that I had to go through about mid-session. And that is honestly, I've walked through that then the rest, you know, ever since then of going, oh, these things are happening at the federal level. Well, yes, I can call Congressman Arrington's office and use our voice there, but it's also not up to me. Um, and that's I think that's we just, yeah, we got to take those superhero capes off and realize we can only do so much. I also think I'm a big supporter of mental health. Have a therapist, have a, you know, have a somebody that you talk to so that you're releasing some of that somewhere. I think especially when we get into those professions, because some of our professions in nonprofit are more confidential and we can't talk about some of the things that our clients or somebody are sharing with us. And so making sure that we do have that outlet, whether it's with a supervisor or a therapist or something, that we have that outlet. Um, but surrounding yourself with the right people and then taking off your cape and realizing you're you're not a superhero, you're not Jesus, you cannot do it.

SPEAKER_00 48:36

That is insightful, and I appreciate that. I I I talked with an old colleague on one of the early episodes of the podcast, a guy named Sean Litton. He was um we talked about this. That that was that was something I struggled with when I was in Rwanda, you know, child sexual assault casework, and it just got this point like it's all on me that these kids get justice. And he and it was just unbearably heavy. Right. And so he had some you know, throughout a big team meeting, had some really good perspective and insight on that, exactly in line with what you've talked about, of taking the cape off and focusing on what you can control and not taking on things beyond your control. So uh I really appreciate that. Thanks for sharing that.

SPEAKER_01 49:19

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 49:22

For uh our last topic is advice for emerging leaders. What advice would you give someone stepping into leadership for the first time?

SPEAKER_01 49:31

Oh man, um, well, that's man, maybe maybe I'm just a nerd for every topic that you've brought up, Lane, because this is another topic I can nerd out. We actually just launched our um 2026 loaned executive program, which is an emerging leaders program um that you guys have actually helped with some of the training on before. Um, so and and I love working with that group because you know, I see so much of myself young and idealistic and wanting to change the world, maybe putting on the superhero cape, maybe, or at least going, okay, this is a place that I can influence and I can and do good. Um, there's probably a couple of things. It's okay to fail. I think this emerging leaders generation, this Gen Z that's coming in, they have a really hard time with failure. Um and and I know everybody at the, you know, all every one of our generations in that 20-something, we've probably all had a hard time with failure. But I think their generation, and I don't want to blame it all on the parents. I think the parents, the schools, the technology that was available to them has just made at least the work component easier. I don't, I think there's definitely parts of their personal lives and you know, dealing with mental health and that stuff, that that's a lot harder. But just the work, like doing work, has been easier because they've had so much available to them. And that tends to change though when you actually get into the work environment. You don't have as many resources that you can lean on when you're in school, when you're in higher ed as you are when you get in the work environment. And failure is actually a really important component of being a successful leader later on. When you've had some of your own failures, then you're supervising, you're leading somebody who they're having a failure. You know how to express empathy in that situation, have humility in that situation, and help walk them through that. And you've also had you also have those life lessons as well of like, oh, I'm not gonna do do it that way again. I I'm I'm gonna do, I'm gonna try this way over here. So don't be afraid of failure. I I would also say humility is really important. I think we've lost that a lot in leadership um over the last decade and so or so. Um and and that means when you do have those failures, owning that and saying, I'm I'm sorry, like not just I apologize, da-da-da-da-da-da-da. No, I am sorry. Yeah, this made this harder for you. Like a real true apology and really and and being okay with that. I mean, I I can remember times that I, you know, hid things, you know, and you know, from my colleagues or from my supervisors and was like, oop, I didn't do that. Let me hide that away. And man, if I had just brought that out in the open and just said, hey, I screwed this up, like, can you help me get it fixed? Like, I think I would have gone farther faster if I had done that. Um, so I would definitely, I think that bringing some more humility, bringing some more willing to willing to take a risk too, because risks also may end in failure. But if you don't ever take the risk, how are you gonna know how that's gonna end up? And this is probably my my last thought on that. It's a little bit of a soapbox for me right now, um, as I'm you know leading multi-generations right now. Um, mental health is valuable, but so is hard work. And I I think we are having a pendulum that is swinging too far the other direction. My generation was gonna, and our parents' generation, we were gonna work our nose to the grindstone and be exhausted and have burnout and just really drive ourselves into the ground. And that was not healthy. This generation, I feel like I'm seeing a lot of everything's about my mental health all of the time, or it's about my self-care, or it's about and then the work's not getting done. And and it's gotta be in between those two. Like we've got to be able to do self-care and have hard work and recognize some other things that we can do to still make sure that we are taking care of ourselves, but also that the work is getting done.

SPEAKER_00 53:45

So that's great. All good points. I appreciate that. Well, uh, looks like we're out of time. It's been it's flown by.

SPEAKER_01 53:55

It's been fun. Again, I get nerdy about these topics. So we get Lane, we can talk about leadership anytime you want to.

SPEAKER_00 54:02

Thank you so much for joining me, Amanda. It's been a pleasure to talk with you.

SPEAKER_01 54:06

Absolutely. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 54:08

I've loved hearing your leadership journey and to get practical takeaways that we can all incorporate in leading our teams. Listeners, thank you for joining me on the Leader Fast Lane. If today's conversation sparked a moment of reflection or a lane change in how you think about leadership, take a minute to share this episode with someone you lead or learn from. Join me next time when my guest will be Dennis McCula Jr., CEO of the Land Improvement Contractors of America. You can find more episodes wherever you get your podcasts. Until next time, keep leading with purpose, integrity, and clarity, especially when it's hard.