The Leader Fast Lane - Episode 19 - with Cole Johnson, EVP & COO of the Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center

In this episode, I talk with Cole Johnson, Executive Vice President of Operations and Chief Operations Officer for the Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center. Some highlights include:

6:28 - Seek to improve yourself and other opportunities will come; say "yes" 

11:48 - "Brains are sexy": be a lifelong learner

20:54 - Collaboration and competition are needed to achieve big things

32:14 - Make decisions based on values and information on hand, and be willing to pivot if need to

40:00 - Trust your people, and verify with grace

46:58 - For emerging leaders, a strong work ethic and a sense of others-focus are key

Transcript

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Hello, and welcome to the Leader Fast Lane, the podcast where accomplished leaders from higher education, public service, and beyond share real stories, practical principles, and hard-earned lessons listeners can apply immediately. No buzzwords, no shortcuts, just real leaders sharing real lessons you can apply right away. I'm Lane Mears, Assistant Vice Chancellor for Leader and Culture Development at the Texas Tech University System. Today I am joined by Cole Johnson, Executive Vice President of Operations and Chief Operating Officer at the Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center, an enterprise operations executive with more than 13 years of institution-wide leadership across TTU, HSC, and the Texas Tech University system, often behind the scenes, always at scale. His hallmark is converting complex, multicampus priorities into calm, strategic execution that holds under pressure. He has facilitated the redesign of executive governance, including the President's Cabinet, Advisory Board, and Executive Councils, overseen multiple university strategic planning cycles, led the COVID-19 operational cadence adopted across the TTU system, and stood up or scaffolded enduring institutional functions, including the Institute for Telehealth and Digital Innovation, Title IX Infrastructure, Research Innovation Leadership, the Division of Institutional Excellence and Culture, and the Division of Rural Affairs. As Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer, Johnson leads enterprise operations across TTUHSC, including multicampus facilities and space strategy, emergency management, information technology, human resources with operating cadence, and cross-functional execution. He earned his JD from Texas Tech University School of Law, his BS from Arizona State University, an executive academic certificate in executive and professional coaching from UT Dallas, completed the Governor's Executive Development Program at UT Austin's LBJ School, and is admitted to the Texas and Arizona legal bars. It's great to have you on the podcast, Cole. Thanks for welcoming. Thank you for that introduction. Glad to have you. I look forward to our conversation. As we begin, could you tell us a little bit about your background and leadership journey? Yeah, it's interesting as you go through that bio and sit back and reflect on the history that I've had at Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center. My path here wasn't normal, as you said. You know, I attended law school at Texas Tech University with all intentions of practicing law indefinitely upon graduation. Practiced for about a year and a half, and then had a friend who was working at the Health Sciences Center that told me about his job and some of the exciting work that he was doing in health transformation. The university received a grant to help providers in rural Texas adopt electronic health records. So switching from paper records to electronic health records. And as he was sharing that story, it really sparked my interest and basically created a pathway for me to enter the university to help with that project. And I've been going ever since. I think without that, it would be hard in a professional setting. I think about how grateful I am that we have that embedded in the work that we do, whether it's our learners, our patients, or just those that we work with, that each and every day we're trying to advance something beyond just the bottom line. So in our case, advancing healthcare access for communities in rural areas of the state, and then building out service models and research and other initiatives that can influence and drive innovation, you know, across the nation, across across the world. So I'd say that gearing myself to mission-driven purpose has really been what I've tried to do each and every day. And all the other opportunities that have come alongside that are because of my approach of just trying to get show up every day, work hard, and move the needle forward as much as I can. And luckily, I've been blessed to have so many doors open on that pathway from starting a department, working my way into leadership, uh becoming the special assistant to the president, chief of staff to the president, uh, moving over to the system office in government relations, and then now being back at the Health Science Center in operations. Well, I I I appreciate your sharing that background. Uh the what what you've described the about Texas Tech, the whole system, mission-driven, very values-focused. Is it it it ruminates. I mean, it it echoes with me as well. That's the reason that that I was drawn to this. The system and this role that I've got as well. And and I've shared this when we had President Um Haney from Midwestern State University of Texas on on the podcast about a month ago that um when we go to these campuses and and conduct leadership development trainings, workshops, programs, um it's remarkable that the students understand and aim to live out those same values on the campus. It's not just words on a page, it's not just an idealistic future, but it really is being lived out um across the system. And it it's it's a it's a it's a great place to invest our time and careers in. Yeah, it changes everything. I'd be nervous to leave this organization and go somewhere else and to know whether or not that culture exists and if that mission-purpose approach to work exists because it is such a big part of who we are and how we show up each and every day. Yep. Excellent. All right. Well, I've got uh a series of questions on some different themes that I'll ask throughout our time together. Uh first section is going to be just on more, a little bit more on your leadership journey. So you've moved across law, like you said, government relations, rural affairs, telehealth, and now executive operations. For you, what is the through line in your leadership journey in those different roles? For me, I learned an important lesson going back years ago in high school. I was a lifeguard in Arizona. As you said, I went to Arizona State. So grew up in Tempe, Arizona, and was a fish since I was a little kid, did swim team throughout all my you know, educational elementary, middle school, high school, was a lifeguard, lifeguard instructor. And it was interesting as I was just a 16-year-old, you know, how quickly I advanced in that position. And why I advanced is because there was an opportunity to get certified as a lifeguard instructor. So beyond just being a lifeguard, and my boss approached all the guards, and I took advantage of that opportunity. And because I was able to get that next level certification the next summer, I was able to come back as a manager of the pool I was at. Um, I was managing people that were older than me at that pool, and it was interesting, you know, it kind of taught me this lesson of seek opportunities to improve yourself, and other opportunities will come professionally. And that was instilled in me at that young age. And I think that's something I've approached with my leadership and professional experience going forward is just any opportunity that's in front of you, you should take step up and say yes. I mean, the worst case you could do is just get a new skill set, and whether it applies or not, um, you know, it'll still benefit you and improve you. The most the best investments you can make are in yourself. And this was kind of reiterated to me again when I was in law school. I was working throughout law school. Uh, I started law school with a young family, which is ill-advised but doable. And so I had to balance education and studying with trying to have some income to reduce the amount of debt that we'd have on the other side of law school as my wife was taking care of our young children at home. And so in law school, you have the opportunity to do stuff activities in your third year beyond just the coursework. So one of those is participating in the journal, and they have leadership positions in your third year. And we went in and interviewed for the leadership positions. I didn't elect to be the editor in chief on my application thinking I was going to be too busy trying to bounce family, schoolwork, my job, preparing for the bar exam. And so I didn't think it would be in my best interest, nor would I do that role, you know, credit, knowing how stretched I would be. So, anyways, we do the interviews. I the position I applied for was the lead articles editor, which basically was to solicit articles from professionals. We get through the process, and the committee says, Cole, one last question for you. And they said, Why didn't you put down that you'd be the chief editor in chief? And I told them my reasoning, and they said, You're the most qualified, but for you not putting it down as your preferential position, we're not going to select you because you know we want to give that opportunity to someone else. And so that taught me another lesson of don't count yourself out prematurely. So I think those two things stacked upon each other. One, as opportunities are given to you to enhance and further your own credentials, take them. And two, you know, strive, strive for positions and opportunities that you don't think you might be qualified for. And that's something I've been doing ever since. So it's put me in some hard situations. Um, when I walked into the office of the president to be the special assistant to the president, there was a change in leadership in the Title IX coordinator position at the Health Sciences Center. And essentially the president looked at me and said, Cole, you're an attorney. I think you could figure this out. And I said, Yes. And I had no idea what I was getting myself into with Title IX compliance and developing sort of how our university was structuring uh our approach to Title IX. And that was probably one of the hardest ones that I volunteered for and had a lot of real responsibilities associated with it. But even from that, it taught me a lot about human resources. It allowed me to engage with legal in a different way than I had to before my career. It allowed me to engage with uh campus, police, and security in a different way than I ever had to, and it worked across our campuses. And so every opportunity, whether big or small, will give you new paths, new experiences, and it sort of builds and grows from there. So I'd say those would be my two biggest lessons is train and advance when you can advance, and yeah, don't count yourself out when opportunities present themselves. Great tips. Great tips. Invest in yourself, say yes to opportunities and grow from the process. I think that's that's invaluable. Yep. Good. Was there a specific mentor leader experience that shaped you, how you lead? Yeah, I would say my biggest mentor has been just my family, to be honest. I come from a long line of educators. The running joke in my family is my grandma would always tell us brains are sexy. When we talk about people who we're dating and different things, that's what she'd ask them about, ask us about their educational pursuits. And I think what that instilled me is just again, that that lifelong learning lesson and how important that is for someone personal. Because whether you have career opportunities or not, no one can take your education away from you. And you know, my parents are both educators. My dad uh worked in the school districts as a superintendent, my mom was a teacher for special needs children. And so each and every day, I think that's the lens I grew up in and looked through is the lens of an educator and supporting those around us for that attainment. So I think my mentorship really spawned in my family, and I look to them each and every day still, you know, if if I need advice, um, I take my dogs on a walk and call my brother and just sort of bounce ideas off of him, knowing that that's sort of my safe space because that's the mentality uh that I grew up around. And I know I can bounce off ideas off my family, and they're gonna look through that lens of you know, how does it support education and how does it help others grow and really not look at it through any other lens beyond those sort of altruistic purposes? So I feel like that's a good safe space and really has allowed me to grow in my professional development. Well, what a great resource. That's that's people that are always gonna be there to have that be that sounding board and source of advice. And by the way, I'm gonna title this episode Cole Johnson Brains Are Sexy. I tell everyone that that was my grandma's famous line because that's all she cared about. She's like, Cole, how smart is how smart is that person you're dating? She's like, remember, brains are sexy. That's awesome. Great. All right. Well, our next theme is gonna is rural health and mission-driven leadership, something you've talked a little bit about about. Um, so the Texas Tech Health Sciences Center has a unique mission serving rural and underserved communities. Why is that mission personally meaningful for you? Yeah, it's very interesting. You know, growing up in Tempe, Arizona, I obviously didn't grow up in a rural community. When we moved to Lubbock, Texas for attending law school, it was kind of like I remember seeing this image online when you Google Lubbock, Texas, it's like Lubbock, where the wagon broke down. And in many ways, it it felt like that moving out here, just how remote it was and is the fact that once you leave Lubbock, you know, you're out there in the plains for hours with not a lot of other engagement. And it took a while for me being here to understand the value of West Texas and rural communities. In law school, my desire was to get back to Phoenix. I mean, my long-term professional goal was to be at a downtown office in Phoenix practicing law. And the timing of being in law school, 2008 to 2011, was a difficult time in the economy in America. And that rang true. There was students in my first year of law school that were in their third year that had job offers being rescinded while they were in school. And my graduating class, only a handful of us had positions. And my position happened to be with a law firm here in Lubbock. I'm I'm super grateful for the gentleman that offered a guy from Arizona a job out here in Lubbock, and that changed everything. I'm here because someone offered me a position that to them, you know, I probably was a flight risk. You know, once I got my experience, I'm sure that they assumed I would head back to Arizona or at least to another community. But in that experience, like I said, in that year, I got to do a lot of agricultural law. I got to go out to some of the communities around Lubbock, which I really didn't do in law school, and just learn more about the region that I was living in. And like I said, once I had that opportunity for my friend that was telling me about the work that they're doing in rural Texas to help healthcare providers, it kind of just lit this spark in me about you know, how how awesome is this field, how interesting would be this work to sort of progress this giant need. And it kind of was like an epiphany because I grew up going outdoors a lot, mountain biking, rock climbing, all the things that Ludwick doesn't have to offer. And I was sitting back one day thinking about you know, the beauty isn't in the landscape around us, although the sunsets are gorgeous and the skies are amazing. The beauty is in the people of this geography, and the people are embedded to these communities, and that that's just amazing. And I would tell you this last year, as I was working more directly in rural health and going out to a lot of our rural communities, being on the road quite frequently, it is so impressive to just meet people and learn about their lives and learn about their journeys and what they're committed to. And I remember in Fort Davis, Texas, on their food bank, there's a quote, I don't know who they attribute it to, but it said, When the need is great, we do great things. And that was so true to me when I saw that, and it sort of summarized you know the last 13 years of my life at the Health Science Center and just everyone that we worked with and the time we put in. It's because the need is great. And so we show up each and every day and do great things in the work that we do. So again, that mission-driven purpose is critical to me. It wasn't part of my journey originally. You know, I didn't go to law school to save the whales and you know do do type public service law. I went there, you know, to get a good profession that I could go back and practice corporate law. Um, but I can't imagine it any other way than how it turned out. And like I said, I would be fearful to leave this organization and go somewhere unless I could feel a similar mission-specific driven tie and and a culture of team members that are striving for the same type of goals. Yeah. Well, I love to hear that that journey. It's um in in some ways parallels with mine. I I was also a lawyer, practiced for roughly 10 years in Austin um before getting a vision for uh using my degree, my my experience at that time, you know, also my faith in in some work overseas. And so I totally understand the um the draw of of uh connecting with people and wanting to use uh that experience, that education to tangibly impact the lives of people that not to denigrate the practice of law. I did it for a long time. I have friends that are still doing it, but there's just something different about being in an organization where that is the main focus. Um so I respect that. Yeah, I feel blessed that I had this opportunity a year and a half in versus being longer in practice of law and then you know, because I'm sure I would have felt a pull as years went on. I would say this having that background in law is critical to what I do. Being in healthcare and higher education are probably two of the most regulated and policy-driven fields that one could be in. And so being able to intersect and walk through the community-based aspect, but also be able to keep up with the complexity of all the regulations and mandates that we have to adhere to as state agencies and in healthcare, it has been a strong foundation for the work I do each and every day. And it's allowed me, you know, going back to the leadership and just the opportunities that I've had, I think that legal background has truly allowed me to span across all the areas and functions of the university at a capacity I wouldn't be able to do without it. Yeah. Excellent. Well, get talking back about or getting back to uh your engagement with rural communities, what leadership lessons would you say you've learned from engaging with those rural communities? You can't take credit. If you're trying to uh take credit in this space, you won't be able to succeed and have the impact at the level that we need to. And that was something I really focused on this last year. Uh obviously, we're not the only university in the state of Texas. There's many universities, many systems, and there is a value to rural health care, not just doing the work, but I think you know, you do get some public relation credit for showcasing the efforts in rural health care. It speaks well to the state. I think it speaks well to grants, it speaks well to philanthropy. And so there's other other universities and other efforts in this space. And so it can it can easily become territorial. And if you look through that lens, unfortunately, it doesn't support the communities. And so I was walking in to the rural affairs role to try to think through how we can really embrace our communities and how can we look like we're aligned with some of the other interests that might be present in our region. I think Texas Tech has benefited being out in West Texas for many years that we've had this space to ourselves in many aspects. But I think as there's been more awareness on rule over the last few years, there's been growing interest from other parties. And so I spent a lot of time intentionally building relationships and trying to align rather than compete across the state in this space. And one of the best examples, and something I'm very proud of, is the work that we did with AM University and their College of Medicine and their telehealth institute. We've been working on telehealth at the Health Science Center for over three decades. AM's been working on telehealth for multiple years. They have strong partnerships. We have strong partnerships. And it kind of was like, what are we doing if we're not doing this together to some capacity? And so we were at a meeting a couple years ago, just sitting down, you know, after the conference, and I kind of just put that on the table of, you know, what can we do together to help these communities and not, you know, look like we're stepping on toes in this space, and kind of just really leaned in on that quite a bit. And that team at AM has been amazing. The team here at Texas Tech has been amazing. And we worked together to put together a telehealth container clinic in Fort Davis, Texas last summer. And I tell that town all the time that if for anything, they should sort of put on their town, you know, why come to Fort Davis? I said it's probably the only place in the state of Texas where in arm's length you could touch the Texas Tech logo and the AM logo at the same time. But we put both logos on this container. And so we have it's a communities clinic, but Texas Tech is providing the primary care services via telehealth. AM is providing the behavioral health care services via telehealth. And it's a scalable model that we can implement in many communities that have little to no access to health care in the state. And so I think that's a critical part of the work that we do. Whether it's a rule or in other applications, is how can you find partners that are similarly situated? I think competition is healthy in the workspace because that drives innovation. But you need um competition and collaboration tethered together to help really address the needs that we see each and every day. And I wish there'd be more of that across the state and across the nation. I think there's great individuals coming together. And I've been thinking about that, you know, how do we create more forums for the conversations to sort of learn, uh lean on each other and see what we can do together. And so that's sort of the unofficial slogan or mantra we developed is together, we are better. And it's been something we've been saying quite often uh when we're in conversations with other partners across the state. Excellent. Follow up on that, and and drifting into our next uh theme of organizational culture and leadership. You talk about alignment and the work with uh AM on the telehealth, which is fantastic, which is in a sense external alignment on priorities and efforts. But in how do you maintain clarity and alignment internally across such a large organization? Yeah, and specifically at the Health Sciences Center, we're very unique in the fact that we have multiple programs and then spread across multiple locations. And when I talk to others about that structure, you know, it is a distinguishing factor. The fact that we are basically headquartered in Lubbock and have our campuses in Amarillo, the Permanent Basin, Abilene, and Dallas. And this is even a unique aspect within the system. You know, when you look at Angela State and Midwestern State, Texas Tech El Paso, and then Texas Tech, you know, they have other campuses, they're you know, it's not quite the same that the Health Science Center has of these true formidable campuses. And then with that comes different groups of stakeholders. I mean, when we go to Amarillo, Amarillo sees that as their campus and that's their priorities. And you go to Permi Basin, that community sees that as their campus and that as their priority. So although we operate in this system perspective, our communities don't necessarily see us in that larger perspective. And so that's something that we are constantly navigating at the Health Sciences Center, and then like I said, it expands into Texas Tech University system as well. I think the key thing is this idea of systemness. And we had some initial conversations at Texas Tech University System in this regard and alignment of all those that are working in these spaces. And the reality is going back to that point that it's complex. And I shared this message with the team at the Health Science Center. We did a master plan a few years ago, and it's 170 pages, and then they just did a strategic plan that's over 30 pages, and like that's great. And I think that speaks to the great things we're doing and the complexity. Now, the question is to the day-to-day team member, what does that mean? Where do they even start? Their focus on doing their job. How do you bring these larger concepts in? If you're to drop the master plan off and the strategic plan, they would sit on the shelf and never be touched. Not because the team member doesn't want to engage at that level, but the realities of their day-to-day balance with these larger visions. So I think that's something that, as leadership, is the constant, constant tension, the taking the university to the next level and everything that's built into that versus the tyranny of the urgent and the day-to-day pressures that staff members feel. And how's that all connected? I don't have an answer on that beyond, it's just something that I've been really acutely aware of, especially walking to this new position as chief operations officer, because I feel like that's part of what I need to focus on in this position. A lot of what my thoughts have been gravitating around is sort of what is that rhythm or sort of drumbeat of the university, sort of that heartbeat. And you see this in music, and it, you know, if you keep the rhythm and the steadiness sort of going, that that hum, that consistency, then you can have the sparks of the soloist, right? As different accompanies are put together, because you have that foundation that's steady and consistent, and so it allows these sparks and allows these opportunities of highlights and growth and sort of sort of you know, pushing off and playing off each other because there's that anchor. And so that's why I think when we look at the complexity, how do we keep finding our center, our anchor will be important? So mission-driven purpose is a key part of that. I think the culture within the university is a key part of that. I think just you know, to identify and speak to who we are and what we do is a key part, you know, being able to sift through that complexity and be like, this is what we're trying to accomplish each and every day, and make it make it simple for us internally and for our external partners. So no, no clear answers laying on that, but more just that's where I've been gravitating towards because I think it's so important. I put myself back 13 years ago when I was starting here, or even going back to law school, I didn't know who the president of Texatech was, much less the chancellor of the system or any state legislative official, right? And at the leadership levels, we put so much time, not agonizing, but strategizing around these levels of leadership that to our learners and to our team members, they have no idea who we are, or do they care, right? Like their world is is so far removed. Sure. And so how do we how do we focus that energy on that and and not as much on what we're focusing energy on? Because I that that's where I'm I'm trying to think through and and uh develop some good strategies around just because I don't want a team member to be sitting in Amarillo, Texas and feel disconnected to the mission. Yeah. Or a learner to come here and leave the Health Science Center and not feel that they had a taste of the larger work that we do in the space. If they just came here, got their education, checked the box, and moved on, we missed that opportunity. And I think that's a critical part of who we are and what we do, and how again, how do we translate that down internally to all of our internal? And then if we do that, it will shine externally. Yeah. Good. Good, thank you. Our next theme is uh decision making and leading through change. It's a question I oft I ask uh several guests on this podcast is how do you approach decision making when there's incomplete information or competing priorities? It's not that they're not important. I was just thinking about that. Like the the team member, once you're at those levels, yeah, they're not on the radar, but we're all very important in all of our positions. Of course. Okay, speaking about change, you don't have the clarity you need all the time. I think this resonated during COVID. We're working on changing our strategy hour by hour as new information came out some days. For those in leadership, you have to be comfortable with the exposure. And this is a term I pull from the mountaineering world that sort of exposure is your risk to um just the open environment. And it's very interesting. My dad and I would talk about this a lot while hiking and climbing, especially as we took new people that were uncomfortable with being at that level in those exposures. You know, if you had a sidewalk on the ground and you walked on it, you'd probably feel very safe and comfortable. If you were to elevate that sidewalk 100 feet in the air, even though it's the same structure and the same, you know, steadiness, and let's say, yeah, the integrity of the sidewalk is the same, even though it's elevated, you'd be very fearful just for the fact that now on each side of the sidewalk there's 100-foot drop-off. And I think that's what happens in leadership. You know, the foundation that you're on, you're at the same place, but also in your elevated, and you don't have those guardrails in place per se. And so that's where I think the grounding is so important to understand as you make decisions what are the key things that you're going to make those decisions based off of that will ring true. Even if you don't have all the pieces of information, what are your factors that you're going to sort of put in place that these are your, if I have this and this and this, even if I don't have the whole picture, I'll be able to defend and justify and move forward with my decision. Another key part of decision making, we don't have the whole picture is I think walking through that. I think sometimes leaders are fearful to show or explain that they didn't have a complete picture of information when they made a decision, and they they lean in on the decision, even if it's not the best decision. And so having the integrity to be able to pivot and say, hey, I made a decision with what I had, and now there's new information, so we're going to modify that decision. And when I see that in a leader, it just amplifies my respect for the leader because uh many organizations will make modifications and never say the reason why they're making it is because they were wrong, essentially. Now here's more information that's influencing the decision going forward. So I think being able to have that integrity and be real and explain your decision making as you move along is so important to have keeping the trust of your team members. Yeah, I think that touches on something that that that I come back to a lot in my background and in some of the things that we talk with with students, faculty, and staff about is with leaders. There's this sweet spot of having of of being confident. Leaders who lack confidence, there's all kinds of ripple effects on the team with that. But you don't want a confidence that's arrogant. There's just you need to tie that with humility, like you've said. Someone that can make decisions with imperfect information and trust that it was the best decision that you could make with the information that you had at that time, but then like you've said, have the humility and pragmatism later on to say, you know what, that didn't work. We need to adjust and pivot. Um so that that that pairing of confidence and humility really is uh a winning combo in in leadership. And as we develop as leaders and different roles, as we elevate, like you've said, with the sidewalk example, focusing on self and and the way that we take care of ourselves and think of ourselves really is uh does have ripple effects on the people we lead. I think there's just there's room for grace, especially in today's society, on both sides. I think grace, you know, from a leader down to their team, and then from a team to their leader. I think about that all the time. About you know, everyone's just trying to live by, right? Like at the end of the day. And sometimes when you see how people present themselves, especially those that you know get to the point where they're losing their temper or just that frustration is really coming through. I kind of sit back and be like, What is causing this? Because it's most likely not the issue that we're discussing. There's other things that are playing in, and and why is someone at that level of frustration in the professional career? And what can be done to help someone not get there? Because I think that's that's the worst thing is if you sort of get to those high frustration points or non-communication points, then you can't really have an effective workplace. So, how do you get people sort of grounded and centered and then bring that grace back into these conversations? Because there's a social media trend recently that is sort of showing you know pictures of individuals as kids. And it's like, remember, that's who this person is, right? Whether it's an athlete or some leader, like they're that little kid. I think about my kids, like they're just they're just struggling. And we all are like, yes, we're adults, but like we're still just struggling to get through life, and life is hard. I mean, it's hard for many reasons, and even though we put on a brave face and sort of you know shake off our our what's what's at home when we come to work, but that's a reality. So, yeah, how do we bring grace and sort of that humanistic side into work and and not to make it too sort of soft, I guess, but just those realities, I think, are so critical to treat each other's with respect and grace as we get along each and every day. I 100% agree. And we we focus a lot in all of our programmings on emotional intelligence, and which is both internally focused on understanding how to recognize your own emotions, moderate them, respond positively to them, but also then to be attentive to your people and what they're experiencing and how to uh help them cope and use what they're feeling in a positive manner is another invaluable skill for leaders. And that's the great thing is that that's a skill that can be developed through intentionality, through practice. Um, but I'm not I I think that you're coming about grace with self and others fits in with that. Yeah, uh my goal with any team that I work on is that they're able to sort of find that fire within that basically my job is to cultivate that space. You know, I I had someone tell me once a story about they were wrapping up a position and they were expected to come in as sort of like an exit interview process, and they missed it. And there was a note on the door when they got there that basically said, you know, Johnny, no need to follow up with me. I understand and trust that you were doing the best thing with your time that you could have been doing for this time. And he was telling me that that's that was the case. He was caught up in another meeting that was important, and it was kind of wrapping up the duties of his job, and that he was so appreciative that he had a boss that understood that. Yeah. And I've tried to share that with the teams that I've been around is I trust that you're doing the best thing that you're supposed to be doing with your time. I mean, you're you're an adult, you can prioritize, and wherever you're at and what you're doing, I have to trust that you're doing the most effective thing that you should be doing. And I think if we can see our team members in that light of that confidence and trust in them, I mean, it allows them to have that space to grow, to um innovate, to fail and get back up and try again. I mean, I think ultimately that's that's what you know, the environment that really can drive success and growth as a university, if we can instill that confidence in our team members that we're trusting them to do and spend their time the best way that they need to to get their goal, their job done. Uh yeah, I agree. I feel like I have to ask a follow-up question. I expect there may be listeners that are saying, that's great, but what about accountability? I think with that trust, there is that accountability that's brought into it. When I have that conversation with my team members, that's the expectation of what you're doing with your time is to accomplish these goals and these metrics. And how can I help you in that process? Now I will say, you know, that trust is something that has to be verified and built. I mean, trust isn't, you know, I wouldn't say, Lane, I trust you, and then stamp it, and then forever you have undeniable trust. I think trust is an ongoing conversation. It's an ongoing level of how much trust and it's demonstrated um each and every day. And so I would say that that yeah, I'll trust you, but there has to be results. And if there's not results, then there's conversations and trust can be re-earned and reaccomplished. But yeah, results are still expected in the process. Good. That reminds me of when I when I would lead teams or organizations in my in my prior career, that was the first day, this was a a thrust of of my talk with the team, is that I'm I'm pretty laid back. I'm gonna trust you uh to get done what you need to get done. I'm gonna treat you as adults. So I'm gonna be laid back until I'm not gonna be laid back. If if if there are results aren't happening or things are uh balls are being dropped, then we're gonna have that conversation. But um it's in line with what you said. You you've you've got to be able to trust your people, treat them like adults. Give them clear direction, um, maybe entrust them with with how to accomplish those things, but then there needs to be that follow up and that accountability with grace, with without harshness. Um but that's the way you're gonna build a a team found with a foundation of. Trust. I would say too, it's important that you communicate with your team members as often as you can on that accountability aspect. I think that's an important thing that I try to do is, you know, that the annual evaluation report is something that I always say is very interesting because you know it's that pinpoint in time that you know, you always hear, you know, I I spent 90% of my year knocking out of the park, and then those 10% is sort of what gets hit on that you know annual evaluation report. And so constant praise and constant coaching is critical for all of us. And so finding the time to engage with your employees on that. So and there shouldn't be anxiety walking into an annual evaluation review process. You should have a relationship with your team member each and every day and address things as they come up, whether it's positive, you know, praise or if it's corrective coaching, you know, I think those are the opportunities that you need to engage in as a leader. You can't kick the can down the road and then hope it will improve. You have to you have to engage and and provide that direction and feedback, which as a staff member is so critical because it can get hard, sort of showing up and not knowing where you might be situated in the organization. And especially, I think, on guiding your team. You know, I think back to my early days at the university, some of my worst days are the days I didn't have direction. The days that you sort of sit at your desk and wonder, what am I doing? What's my role? I mean, those are just agonizing days. Um it's not for failure of work or good work, it's just not having clarity, like you said, of the job and position. And so I think the more we can provide team members with that, the better for morale, because I think looking back on those are my those are my hardest days on the days that I feel like, what am I supposed to do today? And if you had a supervisor come by and say, hey, can you really help with this or can do that? Yeah, I'd love to help. And so I always think about that as how many team members just don't know what they're supposed to do each and every day. And is that is that hurting their growth and capacity? 100%. I I've been in that position with a little bit on lack of clarity on what I was to accomplish. And it is a lonely, frustrating place. And and our office likes to say clarity is kindness. You know, if the more we can be clear with with our expectations for those on our teams and around us, the the more harmonious we're going to operate. All right, we're getting close to our end of our time here. So I got a couple final questions for you. One it has to do with with developing future leaders. What qualities do you look for in emerging leaders? The key qualities I look for one is work ethic. I think you have to be able to do the work and have have that proven. I think those that try to talk the talk and not walk the walk are ones that might that's great, and you can play the game for a while, but when it comes down to it, you won't be a strong leader. I mean, to me, that's critical in my success is I know at the end of the day, I I can work when needed to work, and we will work when need to work. And so I just tell it to any emerging leaders like it's great to have that vision and the desire, but you gotta put in the work. I mean, look at any athlete, any and if you hear any of those stories, they'll tell you that the effort not in the spotlight is critical. No one wakes up, you know, as a professional musician, as a professional athlete, whatever it might be, if they don't put the work in behind the scenes. And I think that can't be overlooked. Um, my my friend's dad would always tell us, you know, he owns his own business. He's like, it's not the day job that separates you as being your own entrepreneur, it's the night job. You know, those that do the extra effort beyond the time in the spotlight, that's just paths of success. And no one's watching you during that time. That's that's what you put in, that's your own effort. So yeah, the work is critical to all the other aspects of leadership. Beyond that, um, I think that humanistic side of it, you know, someone that can bridge and support team members, someone that is a good coach. I think some self-reality too, just because you can do the work, you should really ask, should you lead? Because those are two different skill sets as well. Of you could have a great person doing great work, and then you say, Well, you're you're so great at your work, we need you to lead. And it's like, that's a whole different skill set in leading. So do they have that ability to coach and train and not just keep doing the work? Because a leader that keeps doing the work and doesn't empower the team can be a very bad leader, not because they're not good at doing their job. Sure. All right. Uh on final question on the themes is personal leadership philosophy. You've talked about you know, law school, young family, and and the time dedicated there as you've progressed in your role within Texas Tech, you know, additional responsibilities. My question what habits or routines do you use personally just to keep yourself grounded and healthy? Family time. I mean, that's critical of me is being able to be with my family and understand why the the why in my work. At work, I think for me, it's ensuring that I, you know, align myself with like-minded individuals. I think one thing that I benefited from is my approach and being in such a spectrum of positions has allowed me to have access points all throughout the university. At the end of the day, I just want people to know me as Cole. Like I I don't like you know to come in and have my titles. It's like I'm just here as Cole, and I'm trying to show up and see what I can do today to help help the university and to help my team in their day-to-day. So I think that's to me, that's how I say ground is I'm just I'm just here to help, and that's how I approach my job. Yeah, that's fantastic. All right, my last question who's a leader that you admire? There's so many. I think anyone that has honesty and integrity baked in, you know, to be honest, um, Dr. Ted Mitchell is one of the greatest leaders I've had a chance to work around. You know, his comments about people asking him, you know, how's the higher ed business? And he said, I'm not in the higher ed business, I'm in the people business. I mean, that just speaks it that sentence alone and how he approached work, that's framed, you know, how I see how I see the world as well. And so every leader that's resonated around that, and the the whole portfolio of the systems leadership, you know, President Hawkins, President Schoonnik, President Haney, President Ross Bierman, President Lange, uh Chancellor Creighton, Chancellor Mitchell, we have been blessed with strong leaders in our organization. And I think it's because of that, that that humanistic, I think that they look beyond the bottom line, beyond the Excel sheet, and they look at the people. And I think that's a critical part of leadership that I value. I mean, you could definitely value leadership that brings in you know the dollars and the successes, and that's something that we're striving as a university, that that excellence. But if you do it at the cost of the people, that would not be a leadership that I would look as my shining star. And so I'm grateful that we've had the balance of those that that hold us accountable, that have strong vision and want to push us to excellence, but also understanding that we are people at the end of the day and not just, you know, items on a spreadsheet. Yep. Cole, it's been so great to have you on the podcast. Thank you for for fielding my questions, for sharing about your uh your journey and and sharing some tips that that people can apply as they lead their teams. Yeah, I appreciate it. I would say, you know, it's so important for leaders to understand their team, to understand the organization. I would love to see the continual culture of development. You know, I I hate to say it um because it's AM, but like I said, we're we're together, we're better. Yeah. I mean, they do the whoops and the giggums left and right. I don't I don't think Texas Tech needs to be whooping, but that pride, you know, it'd be awesome to have a day where we speak about the Health Science Center in and out of the organization and we get the guns up, wreck them, and yeah, you know, to build that even further than it than it is, um, would be amazing. And so I appreciate the work that you do in this space with Jason and others. Uh when we were, I was the chair of the search committee that recruited Steve Sawson to Texas Tech University Health Science Center. Okay, the position we were recruiting for was our director of HR. And in the interview process, Steve said, I don't do HR, I don't run HR, I do culture development, and it kind of shocked the search committee a bit because that's not what we were looking for. But as he spoke about developing a value-based culture organization, it just rung so true to what we had, and we just didn't have it defined or clarified in a way that we could have some language behind it. We lived it, but we couldn't speak to it. Right. And I think back to hiring that position and going through the culture-based journey and where we're today, it truly is transformative, and so it's so important that we share that journey and share the story, and y'all are doing amazing work in this space. I just give you all credit and encouragement to keep it up because it is different to do in higher ed, but it's valuable. And it has, I mean, if you think about a point of time that has changed sort of our university, it has been this values-based culture journey and creating this language in this space. So it is immensely valuable as a leader to be able to talk to something beyond the outputs and the inputs and talk to who we are, how we show up, what we strive to be. And thank you for your efforts in the space. Well, thanks for saying that. It's been a real joy to do this. Well, Cole, it's been great to hear your leadership journey and to get practical takeaways we can all incorporate in leading our teams. Listeners, thank you for joining me on the Leader Fast Lane. If today's conversation sparked a moment of reflection or a lane change in how you think about leadership, take a minute to share this episode with someone you lead or learn from. Join me next time, and my guest will be Dr. Lori Rice Spearman, president of the Texas Tech University Health Sciences Center. You can find more episodes wherever you get your podcasts. Until next time, keep leading with purpose, integrity, and clarity, especially when it's hard.